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Monday, April 24, 2006

Yom Ha'Shoa

Last year, I wrote about what this Day of Rememberance means to me, and how mad I was that there were many Jews that believed that there shouldn't be a special day to remember the Holocaust. That it should be relocated to Tisha B'Av, because the persecution that we suffered at the hands of the Nazis was no different than any other time we were persecuted in history. (You can read those posts here and here) Basically, my response to them was that if they truly believe that the Holocaust was no different than any other persecution against the Jews in history than they really didn't understand the uniqueness of what the Holocaust was. I'm not about to go through the whole argument again. There's no point, because I'd just end up saying the exact same things I said last year.

What I will say is how much I've learned since then, and how much more I believe the words I said last year. I've read a lot since then. I've read many things I didn't know before. I've read about what the world, especially the United States and Great Britain, didn't do to help the Jews during WWII. I had always, naively now I suppose, thought that FDR and Churchill really couldn't do more than they did to help the Jews. Now, I realize how wrong I was, and how I wish that these facts were taught to us in school. We need to know the whole truth in order to fully grasp the whole scope of what the Holocaust was.

I used to think that Holocaust denial was reserved for the Muslim world, where the Protocols of the Elders of Zion are annual best sellers and skin-head punks in the Neo-Nazi world. How wrong I was about that too. Now-a-days, the most dangerous form of anti-semetism and holocaust denial comes under the cloak of academia and "free speech". There are many in the academic and media world who believe that people who disbute the existence of the Holocaust are just expressing "opposing views" that are simply contrary to the main stream. They call these people the "other side". Some-how and for some reason, only the Jews are subject to another side when it comes to atrocities committed against them. When Deborah Lipstadt was invited to speak on C-Span's book club (in response to her book History on Trial, her trial against Holocaust deniar David Irving), she was told that she was going to be "debating" some-one on the subject on the Holocaust. Very rightly, she refused. She also rightly stated that there is no "debate" on the matter of the Holocaust. There are debates about the details, but there is no debate as to whether the even actually took place and the convergence of evidence that exists to that effect. Neither, is there "another side". As she pointed out, if some-one was invited to speak, during Black History Month or whenever, on the topic of black slavery, would any-one invite or justify another person coming to debate whether black slavery ever took place. HELL NO! You would never hear about it. But, when it comes to the Holocaust, all "sides" are open for debate. Especially, the question of whether it actually happened. More and more, Holocaust denial is not being done in the open. It's being done subtley and by people calling themselves serious academics. Some people, like David Irving, earn respect for their work, so when their true nature is called into questions, other serious and respected scholars defend them. Then, you have anti-semitic and Holocaust denying institutions that write under the guise of scolarly work. Like, the Institute for Historical Review, which sounds so academic, there are many college student cite them as legitimate sources never knowing or being told that they might as well be quoting a Goebbels propoganda report. That's what's makes this form of Holocaust denial so much more threatening than when it's touted by a bunch of skin heads. Nobody takes skin heads seriously, but when remarks are made under the veneer of scholarly work, people stop and wonder if what they're saying actually carries some weight. "I mean, the guy's a professor. Doesn't that mean he knows what he's talking about? Other scholars are saying this guy is a serious historian. What he says must mean something."

The Holocaust is a unique event in time, for the Jews and the whole world. When the Jews were persecuted and murdered in other places by other people, it was done locally and with no intention of spreading to other places. The local government was just "taking care" of their local Jewish problem. However, the Holocaust was the first time in history, that a people were targeted beyond the borders of where teh persecuting government was stationed. Hitler and the Nazis didn't just aim to kill the Jews in Germany and Austria. Their aim was to go out of their to systematically wipe out and eradicate all the Jews in all of Eastern Europe and Beyond. As Professor Lipstadt has reported, new sources are coming out detailing the Nazis' plan, along with the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem to carry out the Final Solution in Palestine. It wouldn't surprise me to find out that there were similar plans formulated for Northern Africa and the rest of the Middle East. The Holocaust requires its own special day, because the world and the Jews (especially those who feel it's nothing special and should be part of Tisha B'Av) need to be reminded what happened and can happen again if we don't take care to ensure it never does. The Western World likes to invoke the memory of the Holocaust whenever they want to make a point about another country in trouble, but they don't really mean what they say. There are millions of Black African Christians being purposely starved and relocated in Darfur, Sudan, by Muslims, and no-one's standing up in the UN and screaming for action. Not one country has called for a special emergency Security Council session to handle the problem. No, that priviledge is only reserved for Israel and the Jews. Anti-semetism is on the rise in Europe, and in many countries is reaching record highs since World WarII. That is not a good thing. Why did the Holocaust survivors not feel comfortable talking about their experiences until after the 1967 6 Day War? Because that was the first time since April of 1945 that they felt that the Jews might actually be safe from anhilation. That's when they felt it was safe enough to let the world know what they went through. Israel and its Jews (and non-Jewish citizens) are on the brink of anhilation again. This time at the hands of an Iranian nuclear weapon. The Western World has their collective thumbs up their butts waiting for Iran to get scared enough to stop their Uranium enrichment. Well, if the Jewish State gets "wiped off the map", what does it matter? It's just Jews. THE HOLOCAUST NEEDS TO BE REMEMBERED AND BURNED INTO OUR BRAINS NOW MORE THAN EVER. REMEMBER! BECAUSE THERE ARE FORCES IN THIS WORLD TRYING TO DO IT AGAIN


At 2:36 PM, Blogger menachem said...

again - tisha b'av works just fine. if we had a day set aside for each and every individual persecution we'd never get any work done

At 5:20 PM, Blogger solitarioh2005 said...

I totally agree.
Did you read my warsaw guetho thread ?

Click here to see it

Or the Strop report

Click here to see it

A very good booh ( as I already wrote is surviving auschwitz ). The book can be found online for download. I found it once tough now I do not have the link anymore

At 5:31 PM, Blogger solitarioh2005 said...

the strop report is fascinating since it was written by the SS commander that carried out the operation.
Germans exceed when it comes to organization . ( It was not by chance that they managed to conquer all western and most eastern europe ).

If it were not for the US ..,the germans would have won the war.
The report is very interesting for another reason. It does show how human beings are capable of demonizing other human beings to such a extended that the latter cease to be seen as human.

For this german commander jews were not human .

That shows up in the report.

The beginning of stroop report :

The creation of special areas to be inhabited by Jews, and the restriction of the Jews with regard to residence and trading is nothing new in the history of the East. Such measures were first taken far back in the Middle Ages; they could be observed as recently as during the last few centuries. These restrictions were imposed with the intention of protecting the aryan population against the Jews.
Identical considerations led us as early as February, 1940 to conceive the project of creating a Jewish residential district in Warsaw. The initial intention was to establish as the Ghetto that part of the City of Warsaw which has the Vistula as its Eastern frontier. The particular situation prevailing in Warsaw seemed at first to frustrate this plan. It was moreover opposed by several authorities particularly by the City Administration. They pointed in particular that disturbances in industry and trade would ensue if a Ghetto were founded in Warsaw, and that it would be impossible to provide the Jews with food if they were assembled in a closed area.

At a conference held in March 1940, it was decided to postpone the plan of creating a Ghetto for the time being, owing to the above objections. At the same time a plan was considered to declare the District of Lublin the collecting area for all Jews within the Government General, especially for the evacuated or fugitive Jews arriving from the Reich. But as early as April 1940, the Higher SS and Police Leader, East, Cracow, issued a declaration that there was no intention of assembling the Jews within the Lublin District. In the meantime, the Jews had increasingly taken to crossing the frontiers without permission and illegally. This noted especially at the limits of the District of Lowiez and Skierniewice.

Conditions in the town of Lowicz became dangerous from the point of view of hygiene as well as from that of the Security Police, owing to these illegal migrations of Jews. The District President of Lowicz therefore, began to install Ghettos in his district in order to avoid these dangers.

The experiences in the district of Lowicz after Ghettos had been installed, showed that this method is the only one suitable for dispelling the dangers which emanate repeatedly from the Jews.

The necessity of erecting a Ghetto in the City of Warsaw as well became more and more urgent in the summer of 1940, since more and more troops were being assembled in the district of Warsaw after termination of the French campaign. At that time the Department for Hygiene urged the speedy erection of a Ghetto in the interest of preserving the health of the German Forces and of the native population as well.

The original plan of establishing the Ghetto in the suburb of Praga as intended in February 1940, would have taken at least 4 to 5 months, since almost 600,000 persons had to be moved. But since experience showed that greater outbreaks of epidemics might be expected in the winter months and since for this reason the District Medical Officer urged that the resettling action ought to be completed by 15 November 1940 at the latest, the plan of establishing a suburban ghetto in Praga was dropped; and instead, the area which hitherto had been used as a quarantine area for epidemics was selected for use as a Jewish residential area. In October 1940, the Governor ordered the Commissioner of the District, President for the City of Warsaw, to complete the resettlement necessary for establishing the Ghetto within the City of Warsaw by 15 November 1940.

The Ghetto thus established in Warsaw was inhabited by about 400,000 Jews. It contained 27,000 apartments with an average of 2 1/2 rooms each. It was separated from the rest of the city by partition and other walls and by walling-up of thoroughfares, windows, doors, open spaces, etc.
It was administered by the Jewish Board of Elders, who received their instructions from the Commissioner for the Ghetto, who was immediately subordinated to the Governor. The Jews were granted self-administration in which the German supervising authorities intervened only where German interests were touched. In order to enable the Jewish Board of Elders to execute its orders, a Jewish Police force was set up, identified by special armbands and a special beret and armed with rubber truncheons. This Jewish Police force was charged with maintaining order and security within the Ghetto and was subordinated to the German and Polish Police.
It soon became clear, however, that not all dangers had been removed by this confining the Jews to one place. Security considerations required removing the Jews from the city of Warsaw altogether. The first large resettlement action took place in the period from 22 July to 3 October 1942. In this action 310,322 Jews were removed. In January 1943 a second resettlement action was carried out by which altogether 6,500 Jews were affected. When the Reichsfuehrer SS visited Warsaw in January 1943 he ordered the SS and Police Leader for the District of Warsaw to transfer to Lublin the armament factories and other enterprises of military importance which were installed within the Ghetto including their personnel and machines. The execution of this transfer order proved to be very difficult, since the managers as well as the Jews resisted in every possible way. The SS and Police Leader thereupon decided to enforce the transfer of the enterprises in a large-scale action which he intended to carry out in three days. The necessary preparations had been taken by my predecessor, who also had given the order to start the large-scale action. I myself arrived in Warsaw on 17 April 1943 and took over the command of the action on 19 April 1943, 0800 hours, the action itself having started the same day at 0600 hours.

At 5:38 PM, Blogger solitarioh2005 said...

and notice how the language is sanitized.

The first large resettlement action took place in the period from 22 July to 3 October 1942. In this action 310,322 Jews were removed.

In other words : 310 thousand jews were send to extermination camps.

The SS commander does call it removal.

Language is sanitized.

At 7:07 PM, Blogger Gert said...


Your assertion that Britain and the US could have done more to save Jewish lives is strenuous to say the least. There was a chaotic war going on, Britain was literally fighting for its own survival. We discovered the camps when we found them. Sure, there were reports about something terribly sinister going on in the East, but these reports were simply too much to believe without more evidence. Remember, the "final solution" was carried out largely in secret. They succeeded in keeping the secret until it was discovered. There is nothing sinister about the role of the Brits or Americans re the Holocaust, as you seem to imply.

Many European Jews didn't see the rising storm either: they simply refused to believe that assimilated European Jews would fall victim to what turned out to be the biggest genocide in human history.

As regards Lipstadt, her reaction is understandable but not necessarily wise. Ignoring Holocaust deniers doesn't make them go away, but debating concisely and accurately can easily destroy their arguments.

Irving, for example, is no longer a Holocaust denier.

At 10:03 PM, Blogger Olah Chadasha said...

menachem, again, you don't seem to grasp the uniquness of the Holocaust in the history of the persecution of the Jews. That's why you think Tisha B'Av works fine, and you are still absolutely dead WRONG!

Gert, once again, you really don't know your history, and I suggest you read at least a couple of books by some serious scholars before you make comments like that. Might I suggest Abandonment of the Jews and While Millions Died. Until you know a little bit more about what you're talking about, there's no point in even trying to talk to you. But, I will say this. The British and American governments knew the full details about the Final Solution by early 1944. In fact, Churchill wrote to the RAF planning department urging them to bomb the Auschwitz camps' crematoria or the railways leading to the camps. His fault is that when the RAF turned it down, he didn't urge it anymore. This in fact when the RAF was bombing factories a mere 7 km from the camps. FDR admitted to the Jewish agencies pleading for him to do something about the Jews' plight that he knew more than they could imagine about what was going, and the only way to save the Jews was to win the war as fast as possible. However, as many historians state now, the Nazis were excellerating the deaths of the Jews so quickly that if the Allies didn't do something there WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN ANY JEWS LEFT TO SAVE. Most World War II and Holocaust historians agree that the US' and Great Britain's lack of action on the matter of bombing the camp or railways is a moral plight on their record. Please, read something so you know what you're talking about.

Irving is still very much a Holocaust denier. You think he meant it when he said he had learned "new" knowledge that shows him that he was wrong? He's made statements and claims since then that directly contradict this claim.

You seriously need to take some history lessons.

At 8:16 AM, Blogger solitarioh2005 said...

this article was written by a holocaust survivor

Click here to see it

The New York Times and the Holocaust.

Click here to see it

I have my strongest suspicions that antisemitism played a big role when it comes to ignoring the holocaust.

Another example of such antisemitism was the atitude of Europe towards Arafat.

He asked for millions of martyrs september 2003...,but people did not care.

Click here to see Arafat calling for suicide bombers in public

He not only called for millions of suicide bombers but actually funded a suicide bomber organization - The Al Aqsa Brigades.

2 months later , November 2003 a BBC investigation found that and BBC is not sympathetic to Israel.

Click here

But prople turned a blind eye to all this evidence.

Europe never stop to giving money to Arafat.

And the us keep protecting arafat

" Powell Informs Israel About Opposition to Arafat Exile
Friday, September 12, 2003

Arafat Tells Supporters They Will Go to Jerusalem as Martyrs
WASHINGTON — Secretary of State Colin Powell (search) assured a senior Palestinian official Friday that he had weighed in with Israel to back away from a threat to deport Yasser Arafat (search).

Before boarding his Air Force jet for a meeting in Switzerland on Iraq's future, Powell also telephoned Israeli Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom (search) to reinforce the message."

In other words: In the moment Arafat with his smile was calling for millions of suicides Powell was calling Shalom , telling him arafat should not be harmed.

In many ocasions events take place but people turned a blind eye either because of prejudice..,or political reasons, or both.


At 8:54 AM, Blogger solitarioh2005 said...

few seconds ago I was thinking that political beliefs are not rational.

They belong to the realm of the emotional , not rational.

Look at pro Palestinians by instance.

Many pro pali are exactly like religious fanatics.

Their religion does have a Saint, Yasser Arafat the Noble Peace Prize.

Who cares Arafat had started the war in Jordan and helped to start war in Lebanon ?

Arafat is their Saint and he is revered like such.

The pro pali creed believes the Palestinians are the victims of the Evil Zionists.

Manichaeanism also divided the world between good and evil.

For the enlightened Europeans the world is divided between the poor pali and the evil Zionists.

No matter what the pali do..,they are the victims.

A suicide bomber exploded in Jerusalem ?

You know..., " "As long as young people feel they've got no hope but to blow themselves up we are never going to make progress" ( Cherie Blair , 2002.

Poor pali. They blow themselves because they have no hope.


Beliefs are not rational.

People believe their beliefs are rational, but they are not.

At 8:59 AM, Blogger solitarioh2005 said...

I believe the origins of Palestianism ( the new belief that does see Zionists as evil and pali as eternal victims) , are antisemitism.

In the antisemitic vision of the world Jews are also Evil and the other fellows are victims of the Jews.

In the palestianism same does happen : Zionists are Evil and the palis are victims of the Evil Zionists.

European Palestianism is a son of antisemitisemitism,

At 9:38 AM, Blogger solitarioh2005 said...

Israel Criticized for Arafat Removal Vote; Palestinians Rally
Saturday, September 13, 2003

Arafat Tells Supporters They Will Go to Jerusalem as Martyrs

Thousands of Children Rally at Arafat's Office

U.S. Warns Against Arafat Expulsion

Israeli Cabinet Decides in Principle for Arafat Expulsion

Powell Informs Israel About Opposition to Arafat Exile

JERUSALEM — The international community roundly condemned Israel on Friday for its decision to expel Yasser Arafat (search), but leaders of the Jewish state shrugged off the criticism.

"In the early hours of this morning the phones rang from all over the world," Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom (search) said. "They're asking us to do nothing against Yasser Arafat. Has the world turned on its head?"

To hundreds of Palestinian supporters, the Palestinian leader said: "To Jerusalem we are going as martyrs in the millions."

The crowd lifted photos of Arafat high in the air, chanting, "With our blood and souls we will redeem you." Arafat answered: "With our blood and souls, we will redeem you Palestine."

As the crowd left, a dozen Palestinians showed their devotion to their leader by remaining in the compound and setting up tents, saying they would act as human shields if Israeli troops move to seize Arafat. In addition, thousands of Palestinians held pro-Arafat rallies throughout the West Bank and the Gaza Strip.

Israel, however, seemed to pull back from any immediate operation, abandoning lookout positions on top floors of two buildings overlooking Arafat's compound.

The Palestinians urged the U.N. Security Council (search) to demand that Israel stop the expulsion. The Council discussed a resolution late Friday and then adjourned until Monday, despite Palestinian pressure for a quick vote.

Israel's government says that as long as the 74-year-old Arafat continues to wield authority, peacemaking efforts will fail. Still, Israel made no move to oust him from Ramallah.


Israel's security Cabinet announced its decision in principle Thursday, two days after twin Palestinian homicide bombings killed 15 Israelis. In their statement, Israeli leaders declared Arafat "a complete obstacle" to peace and said "Israel will work to remove this obstacle in the manner, at the time, and in the ways that will be decided on separately."

That wording makes room for several options: deporting Arafat, capturing him or killing him. The Israeli daily Haaretz reported that when Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz talked of killing Arafat during the Cabinet meeting, Prime Minister Ariel Sharon asked him not to use that term.

Some Israeli critics accused Sharon of making empty threats. "The bottom line is that they're not expelling Arafat," said Emannuel Rosen, diplomatic correspondent for Israel's Channel 10 TV. "This is a virtual game we're playing among ourselves — undignified, not serious."

Abroad, however, there was concern Israel might act and condemnation of the decision was widespread. France warned that expelling Arafat would be an error and the Arab League said Israel had in effect "declared war" on the peace process.

"It would be unwise to expel him," U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan said.

Countries expressing concern ranged from Switzerland to Pakistan. Italy, Russia, Germany and Britain also voiced disapproval.

"We believe it would be a terrible mistake that would have serious consequences across the whole region," EU spokesman Diego Ojeda said.

Palestinian Foreign Minister Nabil Shaath said Powell told him in a phone call that the United States pressed Israel to call off any immediate move against Arafat. He said Powell also gave assurances that the United States would push Israel to meet key commitments of the stalled "road map" peace plan, in particular to withdraw forces from Palestinian cities and freeze settlement construction.


The Associated Press contributed to this report.


Nothing in this is rational.
Arafat does call for millions of martyrs to Jerusalem after a double suicide bombing.

How does react the world?

The world does support him.

(Shalom even asked : Has the world turned on its head ? .The answer is yes.

Beliefs are not rational and the palestianists and others rallied around Saint Arafat when they feared the Saint might be harmed by the Zionists.)

Curiously even for palestianists Hamas is a kind of herectical sect.


Hamas is palestinian..,but.., it is not as popular as Fatah , the main palestianist Church.

At 5:18 PM, Blogger Gert said...


If you're going to try and prove that somehow the allies could have done more to save more Jews you may have a point, you may have not. Nothing in war is perfect but I think very few historians now take the view that the allies somehow sacrificed Jews in order to win the war: resources were scarse and had to be attributed, with the power of hindsight it's easy to point the finger of blame.

The allies weren't to blame for the Holocaust, nor were all Europeans.

Elsewhere you asserted that Britain promised a Jewish homeland, then broke that promise. That's simply not true, unless you understand by that promise the creation of Eretz Israel. The Balfour declaration cannot be interpreted that way. It seems to me you have a lot of issues with the British re Israel, many of which are contentious.

At 8:36 PM, Blogger Olah Chadasha said...

gert, it seems you have inference issues, and you should stop assuming things. You know what happens when you do that, don't you? Please site where I talk about the Balfour Declaration as I don't remember the comment off-hand. As for my contentious claims about British in regards to Israel, please educate me on where I went wrong. We'll see if we can't give you some more history lessons. So far, you haven't been able to successfully refute any of the historical references I used to knock down your arguments. I assume that's because you don't have any argument, so you just fly to some other topics.

I never blamed the Allies for the Holocaust. Again, with the assumptions and putting words into my mouth. I said that there were things that they could have done to help save Jews, and they didn't. Again, you don't seem to really know your history, so it's really pointless to continue on the conversation with you. I also never said that any historians have claimed that the Allies "sacrificed" the Jews for the war. I said that many historians of WWII and the Holocaust state that the proof and the documents show that the Allies could have done more than they did in many different ways, and the fact that they didn't is a moral blight on their war record.

If you continue to twist my words around, say things that I never said, and make stuff up when you don't know the history, there will be no point in even bothering to talk to you. You really don't know what you're talking about. Do you need some more book reccomendations?

At 7:41 PM, Blogger Gert said...

You're right, it's pointless trying to reason with you. You simply dismiss anyone's ideas out of hand, telling them they don't know history or that they are putting words into your mouth.

I can only interpret your words, not take them literally, without context words are meaningless. To you that's probably "moral relativism".

Why would I provide, say a link to the Balfour Declaration here?You'd only dispute the source.

These are you main tactics:

1. tell people they don't know what they're talking about

2. tell people they don't know history

3. tell people they putting words into your mouth

4. dispute their sources

5. tell them your sources are better than theirs.

Have it your way ("my way or the highway"). Olah, Holder of Ultimate Truth.


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